Atheist Armaments

Back from break, finally.

The Creationist ministry website, Answers in Genesis, has developed some rather shrewd tactics for combating modern science. Occasionally, I check into their site to prepare myself for possible counter-arguments when debating Creationists — invariably, most Creationists eventually discover AiG. When they do, they copy-paste and ditto-head the text like they were on Rush Limbaugh’s television show.

The articles themselves are extremely well-written, semantically. The logical fallacies are well-hidden, lies by omission well-crafted, and outright lies and fabrications are glazed over so finely that you could probably sell it at a fine French Pastry shop. But as much as you may glaze a horse-apple, at the end of the day it’s still horse-shit.

So today, I went there and picked a random article from the ticker at the top. I chose Georgia Purdom’s “If human and chimp DNA are so similar … ” found here: ( http://answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v1/n2/human-and-chimp-dna ) Read more

I have read in a number of places that in a formal debate, if either party knowingly uses a logical fallacy, the debate is essentially over. It’s sort of an unwritten rule that debators stick with the facts, the issues, and not personalize the whole affair.

That said, debating an issue that has been tied into an individuals faith will inevitably turn personal for them. It’s unfortunate that religious organizations (such as creationist supergroup extraordinaire AiG) have intentionally tried to tie issues of science (old earth, evolution, abiogenesis, etc.) tightly to the reins of their Holy text. It is important to remember that, when arguing these issues, it is quite easy to degenerate to a battle of gainsaying. There are as many, if not more, websites and materials out there that a YEC will use as support for their argument, and often it can take an inordinate amount of time to de-tangle exactly why the source they are referencing is incorrect. Sometimes you get lucky with an explicit refutation, but more often than not, a counter-refutation will be found somewhere else.

Bottom line — sticking with the issues is often a fruitless attempt when debating YEC’s. Remember, we are not dealing with a rationally minded group of people here. It can often be more effective, depending on their method of arguing, to establish logically why their arguments are incorrect. The goal is to clear up the misrepresentation that their beliefs are based on anything except their faith. (Note: for more information, check out my page about logical fallacies.)

One other point, before we begin, is that learning how to spot logical fallacies can help you avoid them yourself. It’s very embarrassing to point out someone else’s fallacy and then have them (or a bystander) point out that you had unknowingly used the same fallacy yourself. Just remember that the point of spotting fallacies isn’t to specifically to attack your opponent, but rather to level the playing field.

Some favorites, as arbitrarily assessed by my experience: Read more

A friend on myspace posted this Youtube video by Pat Condell. It’s a rather fiery diatribe replying to criticism that he should have more respect for religion and those with faith. He raises some good points, even if his candor is a bit abrasive. I’ve included a transcription of it below. (I won’t lie, it’s partly for search engine hits. :D)

[wordpress is being difficult with posting youtube videos, so you’ll just have to click on that second link above to watch it. It’ll open in a new window.]

Transcription (for those who prefer to read)

Why is faith worthy of so much respect? Would someone show me the calculations, because I just don’t get it. People keep saying to me: “You know, you should show a little more respect. You don’t have to call people mentally ill, just because they disagree with you.” Well it’s not because they disagree with me that I call them mentally ill. It’s because of what they believe about reality, and more importantly, what they want to do with those beliefs.

I mean, if that’s all it was, just a belief, well then I’d have no problem giving religion all the respect it wants. In the same way that I respect a person’s dress sense, or their decor in their home, even if I found it tasteless I would respect them enough not to say so.

But religion is more than just a belief. Religion wants to impose a universal morality, which is why it has always attracted the kind of person who thinks that other people’s private lives are their business. And giving respect to this mentality is exactly what got us into the mess that we’re in.

We’ve given religion ideas that are above its station and we’ve persuaded it that it’s something it’s not, when it’s really that faith is no more than a deliberate suspension of disbelief. It’s an act of will. It’s not a state of grace, it’s a state of choice. Because without evidence, you’ve got no reason to believe apart from your willingness to believe. So why is that worthy of respect any more than your willingness to poke yourself in the eye with a pencil?

And why is faith considered a virtue? Is it because it implies some kind of depth in contemplation and insight? I don’t think so. Faith, by definition, is unexamined, so in that sense it has to be among the shallowest of experiences. And yet, if it could, it would regulate every action, word and thought of every single person on this planet. Because let’s not forget: Even an impure thought (pause) is a sin.

Well, I believe that belief in God is an impure thought. It pollutes our understanding of reality. It gets in the way, and it brings out the worst in the best of us, so that we’re prepared to stoop so low as to poison the unformed minds of the people we love the most: our children. By the time their old enough to think for themselves it’s too late, they’ve been well and truly hypnotized.

I’m sorry, but there’s no nice way to say this: If you fill your child’s mind with images of Satan and the horrors of Hellfire, you’re a sick individual and you are (pause) mentally ill. And the only reason you don’t know this is that you’ve been indulged for far too long by people and institutions that really ought to know better.

The truth is, your beliefs are infantile, your scriptures are lies, and your God(s) are illusions. And I can say that with all due respect because no respect is actually due! And besides, anyone who has to demand respect automatically deserves ridicule. If you deserved respect, you’d already have it; You’d be rolling around in it like a Televangelist in other people’s money. No, what you deserve is mockery.

But I’m a reasonable person, and I want to make an effort, so I’ll tell you what I’ll do. I’ll respect your beliefs for as long as I can keep a straight face while thinking about them. Which should be about…half a second. But beyond that, I’m afraid I can’t promise anything.

In the meantime, I don’t believe that God exists, but if it turns out that I’m wrong about that, then, well, fair enough. I don’t think much of his attitude, to be honest, and if he wants to show himself, I’d be happy to tell him that to his face, if he’s got one. But if God exists, I want him to tell me himself. I don’t want to hear it from anybody else. And in case you’re wondering, that includes you.

So please, don’t quote anymore scripture at [sic] me, I’m really up to [raising hand] here with it. And frankly, I don’t give a damn what the Bible or the Qur’an have to say about anything. You might as well be telling me about your dreams; Which is essentially what you are doing. I mean, I can understand why people are drawn to scripture and religion. It’s because it’s so easy, it’s all laid out for you, all the thinking you’ll ever need, has already been done: You don’t have to lift a single brain cell. That’s so convenient, it’s almost modern.

But what you’ve got to realize is that believing a thing, no matter how strongly, doesn’t necessarily make it real. I mean, you could be hypnotized into believing that you’re a chicken, but you can’t reasonably expect other people to share that belief; At least, until they see a few eggs. And that’s the bottom line here: Evidence. If you show me a few eggs, then I will believe that you are a chicken. Or a Christian. Or a Muslim. Or whatever the hell it is that you think you are.

But until then, please don’t tell me not to mock your beliefs [chuckles]. That’s like telling me not to laugh at your toupee. It just makes the damn thing even more ridiculous. Peace [peace sign] to everyone; And may you get all the respect that you deserve.